LLoyds Standards

This page contains the responses we got when we asked the question
about the meaning of "built to LLoyds Standards" which is stated in so many of the
Cheoy Lee brochures

My understanding of this is as follows:

Lloyd's Register of Shipping is a UK organization concerned with construction and maintenance standards, primarily for commercial shipping. It is similar to the ABS and Det Norske Veritas. It has no connection with the Lloyd's insurance syndicates which are a completely separate organization. I am not sure what the current status of Lloyd's is in relation to the Euro codes (CE marks) for pleasure craft.
Anyway, when our boats were built Lloyd's could provide a variety of services to boat builders and owners.
Lloyd's would provide a "Hull Certificate" certifying that a given hull was constructed using suitable materials and techniques. I used to have one of these for a Westerly built in the UK in the late 70's. I would be very interested to hear if any Cheoy Lee owners have one tucked away in their ships papers. I don't.  Lloyd's also published a set of recommended guidelines for yacht construction ("Lloyd's Standards") which related to materials, minimum scantlings, techniques etc. Now Cheoy Lee did all their own engineering design work "in-house", and I suspect that they did this with reference to the Lloyd's Standards. This, I think, is what they meant by "built to Lloyd's Standards". It is the reason that Cheoy Lees are built so conservatively, as the Standards were designed to produce safe and seaworthy boats. I understand that very few builders in the last 20 years have adhered to Lloyd's Standards ("too expensive and produces heavy boats").
Whether our boats were actually inspected or not by a Lloyd's surveyor during construction I don't know. Cheoy Lee had regular visits from Lloyd's surveyors who inspected their commercial boat building activities. I have even heard that they had a surveyor resident for many years (not an ideal situation, as the relationship may have been a little too close!).
Lloyd's also offered a service whereby they would survey the construction and fit-out of a yacht and certify she was built to "Lloyd's A1". If the owner stumped up for regular surveys thereafter Lloyds would also certify "maintained to Lloyds A1". I don't think this happened for our boats.

Cant guarantee all of the above is totally accurate, but I think it's
close to the truth.


Nigel Evans
Hebe Haven Yacht Club
Hong Kong

I am a retired Lloyd's Register surveyor resident in Newcastle, Australia. I was stationed in Hong Kong in the 1960s and 1970s and have happy memories of working with Cheoy Lee.
Owners who wished their craft, both sail and motor, to be "Classed 100A1 with Lloyds had to specify that the yacht be built under survey.
Plans were firstly approved by Lloyd's yacht department in the UK and Ship and Engineer Surveyors in Hong Kong attended at prescribed stages of construction and outfitting. They also attended during sea trials and a "Class" certificate was issued to Cheoy Lee only when the surveyor was fully satisfied that the craft met the requirements of Lloyd's rules in all respects.
To maintain the craft in Class after delivery, it was the owner's responsibility to arrange for inspection by Lloyds at prescribed intervals.
There is a Clipper 33, Hull no 2965 built 1975, here in Lake Macquarie near Newcastle and under refit right now.
John McCarlie 


Certification and Classification at Lloyd's Register of Shipping

Lloyd's Register of Shipping (which is not Lloyd's of London, the insurance company) is a classification organization that classifies or "rates" vessels including yachts for insurance purposes, assigning a risk management classification ranging up to the highest "Lloyd's +100A1" (the "+" sign is read as "Maltese, an insurance standard). Such a "classification rating" (called "Lloyd's Classification") requires continuous inspection by a Lloyd's surveyor from the initial laying up of the hull through the vessel construction and finally, through the entire life of the vessel to keep it "in classification", as a real Lloyd's classification is an ongoing legal statement that a vessel is current in its survey and has met all required maintenance standards of Lloyd's. This class is used for an ongoing safety rating in the purchase of insurance as well as for the ease of sale of a Lloyd's survey classified vessel, but it is very unlikely that most of the yachts advertised as "built to Lloyd's Standards" ever had such a classification much less kept it up, as it is very expensive and generally unneeded for U.S. yacht insurance, being designed to rate European shipping.
  A lower level of Lloyd's inspection more common in yachts is a "Lloyd's Building Certificate" certifying that a Lloyd's inspector was present at the yard through the specified portions of construction, including testing various materials and making sure critical steps were done to standards.
 More common still, and less expensive, is what is called a "Lloyd's Hull Construction Certificate" (sometimes called just a "hull certificate"), the most common Lloyd's certificate on Cheoy Lee yachts. This certifies that a Lloyd's surveyor actually witnessed the construction of the hull itself, certifying all materials, layup thickness, resin ratios and temperature for proper set are to "Lloyd's Standards". Boats intended for sale in the U.S. usually did not have such a certificate, which added considerably to the cost, not because they are made to worse standards but because there was no insurance savings on boats sailed in the US as a Lloyd's certificate is not needed to insure the vessel.
 Most U.S. insurers simply require a current survey to establish insured value and the Lloyd's certificate's added cost would have made the boats more difficult to sell. My own Cheoy Lee, the Offshore 41 "Dragon of the Winds" originally sold in Southern CA in 1978 apparently has no Lloyd's Hull Certificate- Cheoy Lee says they have no record of a certificate, but they say perhaps Lloyd's has one on file.
 Finally, many boats claim to be "built to Lloyd's Standards", a regular seller's claim for boats built in quality yards where a Lloyd's inspector regularly worked and where some examples of the yacht have been certified, such as Cheoy Lee. Without a real, signed-by-Lloyd's authentic certificate to show off, such a claim is sadly without basis in most cases, as multiple hulls were often laid up simultaneously, some certified and most not.
  In many cases the yacht designer or naval architect has specified scantlings and materials that would qualify for a Lloyd's Hull Construction Certificate using Lloyd's Standards as a guideline, but without a yard statement, naval architect's plans and specs or a Lloyd's Certificate the claim of Lloyd's Standards may have some liabilities to sellers should Lloyd's not be willing to certify the particular vessel in question.
 It is my professional opinion (I have numerous insurance licenses and have seen what tough lawyers do in making claims) that a seller should make no claims as to Lloyd's Standards without a Lloyd's Certificate, the naval architect's spec sheet or a yard statement of standards, as a future buyer could theoretically cause legal problems in event of a vessel failure of construction. I suggest a buyer ask for the certificate, check with Cheoy Lee to see if they have records and finally, if needed, ask Lloyd's Register of Shipping if they have a record of the vessel by builder and hull number, as plenty of certificates are lost.
Best wishes! Frank Koucky

  The following web site has a very good write up explaining the Lloyds Classification as well as ABS and Det Norske Veritas. These organizations provide a quality certification service for various industries and products such as commercial shipping, welding, materials, cranes, etc. as well as yachts. Click Here for a link with a complete description of the "Standards".
Submitted by John Spears


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